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Showing 1-17 of 17 posts in this discussion
Initial post: 28 Jul 2009 20:03:52 BDT
Victor Masih says:
every body that is a keen martin fan should refuse to buy his latest title in a song of ice and fire series...he is taking the piss...it should not take this long at all....

Posted on 29 Jul 2009 23:41:37 BDT
Alice Reid says:
Everyone's anxious for the book to come out and wishes they didn't have to wait so long... but if you're a fan of the series then why would you not want to buy it when it comes out? If the books mean enough to you that you're so annoyed at the wait then surely you're a big enough fan to just enjoy it when it does come out? If you're not that into the books, then just get over it!

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Jul 2009 18:04:01 BDT
VMS says:
I agree totally.

Posted on 1 Sep 2009 18:27:51 BDT
Mr. K. Drage says:
I agree that the book was a long time coming. But to say "Well it took too long to come out so i'm not reading it" seems a little daft to me.
You'd never find out if Tyrion gets away with murdering his father, If Arya becomes an assassin, Never know if the wall holds when winter finally comes and never find out just what the hell is going on with Bran.
I'll definately be reading this installment, and if it gets put back again...... Well i'll just have to read something else in the meantime won't I?

In reply to an earlier post on 2 Sep 2009 13:51:40 BDT
eddie says:
For Gods sake, to threaten an author for not publishing/ or finshing a book within the timescales that you ( as a reader)demmand is nothing short of pathetic! Has our email ridden , instantly gratified, slef obsessed society now gone this far. It makes me laugh if it were not so sad. The author has done his job too well if he stirs this degree of animosity. Tolkien took I believe a lot longer to finish Lord of the rings, over 10 years I think.

Posted on 4 Sep 2009 23:06:36 BDT
I think it seems to be the feeling that he's made so much money out of his loyal readership already that he doesn't seem to want to spend much time writing anymore that has pissed people off. His 'not a blog' is filled with details of public appearances, other projects, tv pilot casting etc etc. I agree that authors need time to produce their best work, not just at the behest of your 'self-obsessed' fans, but he is just as culpable as his fans in the fact that he keeps saying when he thinks it will be published and then reneging on that, which just stokes the frustration of said fans (as seen above!). Personally I wouldn't not read the book, but I may be buying my copy second hand. He doesn't need his coffers swelled any further, and although I know it'll never happen, maybe poor sales would reignite some of his hunger to write...

Posted on 16 Feb 2010 14:09:06 GMT
R. Byers says:
Im also erring on the side of abandoning the books. I personally think he is taking the piss. Lets face it hes not writing Moby Dick for ducks sake (to protect the more sensitive of us) - They are fantasy novels - Good ones true but thats what they are - Other good authors throw these out for fun. George is over-reaching the seriousness/ impact of these books. I imagine he could have released a good version years earlier and no-one would have batted an eye-lid.
Attack me if you wish but thats where I stand.
Why wait when there is just as good out there ?? If you pander to him he will only take 5 years to complete his next tome !

Posted on 11 Apr 2010 19:13:33 BDT
P. J. Smith says:
Although I can't see that saying "every body that is a keen martin fan should refuse to buy his latest title" is that helpful, I can see why you would say that. The last update on his website is two years old (January 2008) and his LiveJournal often gives ample evidence of procrastination. For me, the real question is are we actually going to be a position to choose not to buy Dance of Dragons?

Can readers demand "instant gratification" as eddie suggests? Obviously not, but surely a readership can express frustration at waiting so long. Professional authors construct synopses and outlines for their books. After several books in the series, the author should know his or her characters, the setting and the story. It's really just a question of setting oneself to the task.

Katherine Kerr is a good comparison. Her Deverry series, which is composed of 15 books took ~24 years to write, each book is about 400+ pages. Going off these figures, we should realistically expect a new book in a series every 18 months or so; 24 years/15 books = 1.6 years/book or 240 pages/year (400 pages x 15/24 years). Currently, with a Song of Fire and Ice, we have 4 books written over an 11 year period (each book is about 800 pages long). 11 years/4 books = 2.75 years per book; 290 pages/year. If we compare pages per year then Mr Martin is more productive. However, the difference is that one produces bigger books, and therefore his books come out less often.

However, this calculation relies on Martin writing the books between 1996 and 2005. It's now 2010, and when one considers that large parts of the draft of A Feast of Crows were supposed to form Dance of Dragons and given the number of projected completion dates offered by the author himself, one can understand the frustration of many who have enjoyed the series so far. If we redo the calculation to take into account the last few years, we get 15 years/4 books = 3.75 years/book, or 213 pages/year.

At this point, it's worth mentioning that a break in the Deverry series occurred as a consequence of Katherine Kerr being seriously ill, therefore her calculated productivity would have been higher had this not occurred. Also one can not help facetiously remarking that had George Martin spent less time documenting the writing process on his LiveJournal and used the time for writing those words for his fascinating series instead then there would be less grumbles.

It's worth mentioning that good books don't require an author to write X pages per year but X enjoyable pages per year. Equally, the writing process requires far more editing time then writing time.

Obviously one can not force an author to write what one desires. However, one can express dismay that something enjoyable is not continuing when a number of comments made by the author suggest otherwise.

All I can really say to George Martin is I'm looking forward to your next book but my confidence at seeing its eventual publication decreases with every six month period that passes.

In reply to an earlier post on 10 Jul 2010 17:19:29 BDT
[Deleted by the author on 10 Jul 2010 17:19:51 BDT]

Posted on 1 Sep 2010 09:17:31 BDT
[Deleted by the author on 2 Sep 2010 09:09:21 BDT]

Posted on 25 Sep 2010 17:39:25 BDT
Iain Tomas says:
Don't be stupid folks.
The problem is not Martin's inability to finish this book - the problem is that in today's world its very common to publish book 1 of a potentially infinite series without every considering when or how the others will be completed.
Yes - Tolkein took a very long time to write LOTR - but it wasn't published until completed. What Martin is doing is equivalent to publishing Chapter 1 before he has even considered beginning to write chapter 2 never mind the final chapter of book n!
Goodbye. I won't wait any longer.

Posted on 24 Oct 2010 22:19:38 BDT
R. Byers says:
In reply to an earlier post on 2 Sep 2009 13:51 BST
eddie says:
For Gods sake, to threaten an author for not publishing/ or finshing a book within the timescales that you ( as a reader)demmand is nothing short of pathetic! Has our email ridden , instantly gratified, slef obsessed society now gone this far. It makes me laugh if it were not so sad. The author has done his job too well if he stirs this degree of animosity. Tolkien took I believe a lot longer to finish Lord of the rings, over 10 years I think.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As already mentioned Tolkein may have took 10 years but they were all then published. Martin has taken over 10 years and still no end in sight ! Once he eventually releases the next book , his readers will be back to the usual wait within days. This series has uncompleted written all over it. I honestly dont believe he will live to finish it !

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Mar 2011 10:14:15 BDT
Last edited by the author on 30 Mar 2011 10:20:43 BDT
C. Wright says:
Ya i think your right. Igot a feast for crows in 06 hardback. and the fact its takeing 5y7mths (ireland) is takeing the piss. But when it comes out in july il be getting my copy (sorry people).But it so funny ha. The imp ha when there all laughing at him at his wedding ha...+To keep ye going people chek out joe abercrombis books the first law triolgy. best served cold. and the herios. brutal stuff. Hes up there with the best.

Posted on 9 Aug 2011 12:32:41 BDT
The question people should be asking is not whether they should buy this book. Its whether or not to buy the next 4+ books.
If you have read the last couple of books you know that GRRM introduces new characters and plot threads in every book. The chances of this being tied up nicely as planned is miniscule. None of the plot threads are being resolved. Its not going to be tied up nicely as planned.

Yes ive been reading this since it came out. Yes its interesting. I like the characters. Do i absolutely have to have this? No - there are plenty of equally good fantasy writers out there who are more prolific but less well known. Im happy to wait for the series to come to a conclusion before I buy any more. The only downer is not being able to discuss it with friends. Maybe one of them will loan it to me.

Posted on 10 Aug 2011 10:25:01 BDT
After the poor quality of the last 2 books I don't give a stuff about when the next one is coming. I am looking forward to the HBO series covering book 2 and 3 though, that will be exciting. The HBO guys might even manage to make Feast for Crows and Dance with Dragon entertaining (something George hasn't done)!

In the meantime there is Brandon Sanderson, Joe Abercrombie and many others who are still in top form and are making much better books than George RR Martin is at the moment.

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Aug 2011 15:05:54 BDT
Latenighter says:
Borrow the next book from the public library. If you like it then you can buy your own copy.

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Aug 2011 16:55:10 BDT
Alex Dearden says:
The books would be worth the wait if they were as good as the first three. However, Feast for Crows was extremely bad, just rambling on and on with nothing at all happening and the best characters all turned into idiots: Cersei, Jamie, Brienne, etc.

From what I read of the reviews, the same thing is happening with the latest book. What a disappointment. The first three were so good I read them three times in a decade but based on these last two I think I will give up and wait for the HBO series to catch up and tell me the eventual fate of the characters I care about.

RIP Ice and Fire. So sad.
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Participants:  16
Total posts:  17
Initial post:  28 Jul 2009
Latest post:  15 Aug 2011

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This discussion is about
A Dance With Dragons (A Song of Ice and Fire, Book 5)
A Dance With Dragons (A Song of Ice and Fire, Book 5) by George R.R. Martin (Hardcover - 12 July 2011)
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