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Rory Gallagher would have been wasted(skills wise) in the Stones


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Initial post: 14 Jul 2011 01:03:07 BDT
Just been listening to Rory Gallagher - Deuce, this evening and thinking that his refusal to join the Stones, despite the obvious financial rewards, was the absolutely right thing for him to have done. His playing and writing skills would have been wasted in the Stones. He would have been playing rings around Keef.

As much as I love Keefs playing, which defines the Stones, Rory would have been told to cut down the number of notes he was playing, to use less jazzy chords, to quit doing blindingly good slide solos and so on...........

Was Joe Walsh joining the Eagles the right thing for him to do?

Was Them Crooked Vultures a worthwhile collaboration for any of the band?

Black Country Communion are better, but are they on cruise control? Why don't they let Glenn play funky bass? Is Joe Bonamassa a frustrated 70s style rock slinger and not the saviour of modern blues?

Any illumination/thoughts on these perplexing musical conundrums gratefully welcomed!

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 02:42:50 BDT
Last edited by the author on 14 Jul 2011 03:11:04 BDT
Hammerwood says:
Hi Smitty.... yeah, I think the obvious parallel here is the great Mick Taylor. Whatever Keef might indicate
in his memoir, I get the feeling MT was gradually edged out by both he and possibly Mick too, although the
latter may not have been totally aware he was actually causing an inevitable rift.... until it happened. (We
wait to hear his side of the story!)

As for Rory, I feel sure he would have referred back to his brother and other faithful advisers before making
a decision, i.e., 'the people in his camp' always had his 'best interests' at heart, so to speak. As to the musicality question, I am absolutely sure he would have made as big an impact as MT did during his five year stint with the old laddoes. But it probably would have meant a total shift in style and emphasis, a situation the glimmer twins would not have tolerated for long. Instead of which, we all have Rory's rich solo legacy to hang on to. In fact, I listened to disc 1 of the BBC sessions only a couple of days ago...... who's a lucky boy then?........ Petit moi. (Let's face it, the whole of his professional career was carried out in the best possible taste!)

Why are the above paras such a mess line-length wise? This is not how they were typed and then edited.
Grrrrrr!

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 09:23:17 BDT
Mick Taylors playing was first class and he really took the Stones stuff to an interesting other level. The boot of the Brussels gig in 73 really sees MT in top form, hammerons, slide, firey soloing and yet since then not a lot that I have noticed/heard.

I am not knocking Keef in any way, he is also a great player, the best at his style of playing ;-) But some of these other players are technically better and that would have caused friction. Ronnie Wood is also a great player and more importantly a great band member, which was of greater importance to the Glimmers when they were auditioning after Mick Taylor left. Ronnie can play anything, slide, bass, drums and so on, but tempers it with what is needed to fit the band. He did the stuff on Emotional Rescue when Keith threw the head up at his disgust with Mick for going "disco" on him.

I got a load of Rory recently following a sort of realisation at just how good he is and some of the playing he does is just phenominal.

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 09:23:50 BDT
Anyone reckon Them Crooked Vultures have legs for more than one album??

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 09:30:36 BDT
R. Pini says:
Saw them 'live' they were awful...great light show though. Sad, cos I am a big fan of JPJ' s solo stuff, love both 'Zooma' and 'The Thunderthief'...but the Vultures are just, just... awful.

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 09:31:42 BDT
Nugent Dirt says:
Brian Jones was clearly the real musical talent in the Stones but had to resort to drastic measures to get out
smitty - I think you'll find that 99% of supergroups are less than the sum of their parts, however cr@p the parts were in the first place..Them CV, BCC, Good Bad & The Queen etc...all suck hugely. And I dont get the all the praise for Bonamassa. Technically he's capable but I dont hear anything original or distinctive in his playing unlike SRV who at least had a recognisable sound. Furthermore, he's moved too far away from the Blues into rock territory

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 13:25:45 BDT
BOF © says:
Rory Gallagher in the Stones, would they have allowed him to write say half of the album? In 1975/76 (the year of alleged Stones interest) Rory released 'Against the Grain' featuring "Let Me In" - "Cross Me Off Your List" - "Ain't Too Good" - "Souped-Up Ford" - "Bought and Sold" - "Lost at Sea" - "All Around Man" - "At the Bottom" - all self-penned songs and 'Calling Card' featuring "Do You Read Me" - "Country Mile" - "Moonchild" - "Calling Card" - "I'll Admit You're Gone" - "Secret Agent" - "Jacknife Beat" - "Edged in Blue" - "Barley and Grape Rag" again self-penned.
Could you see them on a Stones album? Could you see Mick singing those lyrics? Could you see Keith adding sloppy riffs and such? I don't know if I could, I think Rory had too much self belief in his own music/ability to play second place to Mick & Keith, plus I don't think he paid too much attention to the great God - Money.
I believe Ry Cooder was the first to be considered (much too talented to play second fiddle to an arthritic monkey) and at other times - Roy Buchanan - Paul Kossoff - Leslie West and Eric Clapton, now Roy Buchanan that would have been interesting.
best bones
B.O.F.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 15:22:21 BDT
I could maybe - and only if they were equal partners - Leslie West and paul Kossoff fiting in with the Stones. As I doubt they would have been allowed such status it would never have worked not to mention have been a waste of talent.
Their other choices you mention - Ry in particular - are a bit out there to have been considered, what were the Stones thinking.
As for Rory, not in a million years, they would have dragged him down.
The fact they wanted to edge Mick Taylor, who I prefer to Richards, out would you would think have clarified their thoughs a bit more on a replacement that would suit what they wanted to do. Were they so far up their own butts that they thought guitarists well able to kick keefs arse would be queueing up?
I'm not knocking The Stones, thought their stuff, especially from that era brilliant

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 15:55:17 BDT
Huck Flynn says:
mark knopfler would have been ideal Smitty
actually listening to Faces at weekend and that guy ronald
wood was ready made
what a combo he and brian jones would have made !
rory should have joined thin lizzy with gary moore but i think he was too busy playing golf

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 22:17:16 BDT
Harvey Mandell and Wayne Perkins were also considered. Anyone heard anything by these guys that is worth checking out?

Keef learned a lot from Ry, enough to do him and then took his own thing to a new level.

The run of albums the Stones put out from '68 up to Tattoo You were fairly magnificent.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 22:22:06 BDT
I agree with the last two statements here, Nuge. Yes, they have/do suck something serious, most especially The Good Bad & Queen(not that the Gorillaz are any better at all, in fact they were even more disappointing when Mick Jones and Paul Simonen failed to bring anything of interest with them) and I fail to get excited by Joe Bonamassa. Derek Trucks is altogether more interesting and innovative, as was SRV.

Brain was musically very talented and could probably gone on to make some great music had he lived long enough to clean up.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 22:25:03 BDT
I love the Stones. Now I love Rory. Stones sloppy but tight playing and a groove approach. Rory was just amazingly talented at getting such an amazing amount of great music out of the geetar. Technically and musically prodigious.

Paul Kossoff and Keef would have been a very short lived lineup. Too much self destruction going on there, although the music might have been amazing.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 22:28:03 BDT
Last edited by the author on 14 Jul 2011 22:53:15 BDT
Saw and met JPJ on the Zooma tour, which was a stunning tour de force. His playing and approach were beyond what I had actually imagined he would be like. A real gent as well. The Thunderthief is an intriguing listen. Ice Fishing is a real weird one, very atmospheric and creepy. My fav track of it is Freedom Song, as far from Zep as you could get, almost.

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 22:28:32 BDT
Johnny Bee says:
Of course Gallagher could have played as important a role, if not more so, than Mick Taylor in the Stones and had all the right credentials - steeped in the blues and a wonderful blues player. However, there's no way the Glimmer Twins would let anyone else too close to the band's songwriting duties - Ronnie Wood only has a dozen co-writing credits to his name. Also, Gallagher was much too talented a guitarist, and probably knew it, to be resticted by Richards, who was still a smack-head at the time. Wood had always wanted to be a Stone, was happy to act as Richards foil, shared certain recreation activities, and therefore was absolutely the right man for the job. And remember it took him 15 years to become a full partner in the Stones' financial organisation. I wouldn't have thought that Gallagher ever considered joining the Stones for too long, if at all, though.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 22:59:48 BDT
Last edited by the author on 14 Jul 2011 23:06:34 BDT
I don't think Ronnie even has been allowed a dozen co writing credits in his time tih the Stones, in fact on Black and Blue he gets credited for inspiration(whatever that means???) for Hey Negrita, not a full song writing co-credit but a tip of the hat and a wink. Ronnie proved himself in other groups and as you say wanted to join the Stones, in every way, making him the ideal man for the job. He did not need to be broken down and rebuilt according to Keefs wishes, he was already there.

I think Ronnie gets unnecessarily slated by a lot of folk. He is a great player and is playing better than ever since he cleaned up.

Posted on 14 Jul 2011 23:04:07 BDT
Has anyone heard/seen anything by that reformed Faces with Mick Hucknall on vocals? I know, I know, Mick Yuknall..................but you never can tell.

This chat about Ronnie made me think of it.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 23:06:06 BDT
Martin says:
And don't tell me, Sting on bass in place of Ronnie Lane??

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 23:10:17 BDT
Glen Matlock from the Sex Pistols, believe it or not.

Just found this - http://www.thefaceslive.com/ and there is a bit of them playing plus an interview. Not as bad as some might imagine.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 23:17:30 BDT
Martin says:
So let me get this straight, The Faces are now Ronnie Wood, Kenney Jones, Ian McLagan, Mick Hucknall and Glen Matlock??

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2011 23:40:56 BDT
Last edited by the author on 14 Jul 2011 23:41:29 BDT
Yes.

They are the ultimate tribute to folks still in the band band.

Posted on 15 Jul 2011 03:38:26 BDT
Last edited by the author on 15 Jul 2011 03:40:12 BDT
Hammerwood says:
Yo - Smitty. Have got a cd copy of the '73 boot supplied free and totally unexpectedly by a
good mate, this from a while back. Very excellent... as my old English teacher might not have
said! Yes, Brian was a real talent too in his day. A great pity it didn't work out for him in the
end but his narcotic problems proved too much for him I'm afraid. (Not that Keef showed much
emotion on his early demise, or ever since, as far as I can tell.) Those the gods love.. die at 27,
etc.

Kossof and Keef? Nah, I don't think so..... there would have been blood on the carpet. Just a
matter of whose (?), really.

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Jul 2011 10:10:28 BDT
Last edited by the author on 15 Jul 2011 10:11:25 BDT
Johnny Bee says:
Smitty

I think we're in agreement and appreciate that Wood is a great guitarist. If you have a guitarist with Wood's playing abilities, look, is desperate to join, and is already friendly with the band, why would you look anywhere else? It was really a done deal from the start.

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Jul 2011 10:25:18 BDT
Last edited by the author on 15 Jul 2011 10:26:08 BDT
Ronnie and Brian, hmmmmm, two multi instrumentalists, one with an interest in world music.

Mark Knopfler, don't know about that. He would have got on with Rory better, possibly.

Can't see Rory with Thin Lizzy after Moore, before him or Scott Gorham, perhaps. I think the band were well set in a strictly rock direction after Scott Gorham joined. Before that there would have been the latitude to take on Rorys zydeco, bluegrass, blues etc..... interests.

Speculation........................

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Jul 2011 10:46:43 BDT
Post Soviet says:
I'm happy with Mick Taylor being a Stone all that time, wouldn;t want to change anything. Btw heard Ronnie admitting Taylor's superiority as a guitarist over him. In a friendly way(they were friends).

Rory...no way, Mick Ronson rather.

Posted on 15 Jul 2011 11:09:41 BDT
Last edited by the author on 15 Jul 2011 13:12:17 BDT
Johnny Bee says:
Not sure about Brian Jones being the real talent in the Stones (some nice slide work though). His contribution to the band after, say 1966, was as a multi-instrumentalist, adding imbelishments if you want. And from all the accounts that I've read, even from his supposed mate Charlie, he was a right royal pain in the arse, whether off or on drugs.
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Discussion in:  rock discussion forum
Participants:  26
Total posts:  132
Initial post:  14 Jul 2011
Latest post:  7 Sep 2011

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