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Posted on 25 Jun 2012 16:40:05 BDT
People,

Below part of The Philocalia of Origen

CHAP. XXIV. ----Matter is not uncreated, or the cause of evil. From Book VII. of the Praeparatio Evangelica of Eusebius of Palestine.

1. I suppose you are aware that two uncreated things cannot exist together; though you seem to assume that they can, and to put the assumption in the forefront of your argument, when you say that one of two things must be admitted, either that God is separated from matter, or, on the contrary, that He is united to it. Now, if any one would maintain that God is united to matter, this is saying that there is one uncreated substance; for each of these two uncreated substances will be a part of the other, and, as they are parts of one another, they will not be two uncreated, but one, consisting of different parts. We do not because a man has different parts divide him into many created substances, but, as reason demands, we say that a single being, a man with many parts, has been created by God. Similarly, of necessity, if God is not separated from matter, we must allow that there is one substance, and that uncreated. But if any one will say that God is separated from matter, there must be something between the two which also proves their separation; for it is impossible to arrive at any idea of distance between two objects, unless there be a third to form the basis of measurement. And this holds good not only of a single substance, as in the present case, but of any number you please; for our argument respecting the two uncreated substances must be no less sound if we suppose that there are three. For we should ask respecting these, whether they are separated from one another, or whether, on the contrary, each is united to its neighbour. If any one decides to assert the union, our reply will be the same as before; if, on the other hand, he holds to the separation, he will have to face the question of the necessary separating medium. And should any one thereupon say that there is a third account which may be fitly given of the uncreated substances, viz. that God is neither separated from matter nor united with it, but is, as it were, locally in matter, or matter in God, let me tell him, and it is the gist of the whole argument, that if we say matter is the place of God, we must of necessity affirm that He is finite and circumscribed by matter. He must, moreover, like matter, be subject to irregular disturbance; He cannot stay in one place, nor abide self-dependent, inasmuch as that wherein He is contained is carried first one way, then another. Besides this, it follows that we must affirm God to be in the lower forms of being.

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/pearse/morefathers/files/origen_philocalia_02_text.htm#C24

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Jun 2012 17:09:39 BDT
"Has Simon "The Fount" Boyd opened a second account, do we think?"

Think you may be right, since only he would be so stupid as to write with the same style under another name.

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Jun 2012 21:42:00 BDT
Ha! Knew you'd not put me on ignore. Guess that you've shown that a troll's word is no good.

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Jun 2012 21:43:47 BDT
Just started reading The Long Earth by Pratchett and Baxter. Very good so far.
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Initial post:  17 Jun 2012
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