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The proposed Dale Farm evictions and connection to 24 "slaves" found on Traveller site.


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In reply to an earlier post on 24 Oct 2011 08:18:07 BDT
C. A. Small says:
Hi Charlie, you may or may not know that the Allied coastal command had a shortcut called the "Donegal Corridor" that ebabled the anti-u boat patrols to cut across Ireland and save time and fuel, thus prolonging their patrol time and being able to push further into the mid Atlantic gap, saving lives and supplies in the merchant convoys. Whilst it is pretty impossible to quantify exactly the result, it may safely be said it was huge.

cheers, Clive.
P.S. apologies for X-factor, soaps and the other dross that emanates from our broadcasters.

Posted on 24 Oct 2011 14:38:46 BDT
Charlieost says:
Sure, not a bother on the stuff RTE and 3 choose to screen. We had a lovely half hour programme lasy night about a barge going down the newly restored Royal Canal, pure magic.

I guess those who programme do so for their expected audience though that rarely seems to be me. TV programmes are made mostly for people who watch television and I don't do a lot of that.

I have noticed that they have started repeating the bit before the adverts in some programmes as if the viewer is to dumb to retain the last few minutes throughout the ad break.

Anyhow. Must get on. I have painting to do in the hall for the missus and it's been promised for months. Thanks for the chat and information.

Best wishes. C ost.

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Oct 2011 13:39:54 BDT
It's the responsibility of every citizen in a democratic state to maintain a helathy vigilence over the activities of 'the establishment' and the agents and protectors of the establishment: the police.

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Oct 2011 13:58:12 BDT
The problematic issue with conspiracy theories is that you never will obtain 'sufficient information to come to a firm conclusion' since it is in this manner that they operate! If you take two formally unconnected events, or series of events, and make a theoretical connection between them your only way of prooving a connection is to turn over the incontrovertible evidence. If you fail to do so then it may be that there is or was no connection (no conspiracy in this instance), but then it is always possible for the conspiracy theorist to continue to argue the alleged connection on the basis of a further conspiracy and cover-up. That is simply the culture and pyschology of the conspiracy theory mind-set.

However, I do not personally think it is stretching credulity at all to posit a bit of stage management on the part of the local authority and police here, when pondering the precise timing of these arrests and allegations. Anyone who naively thinks that local authorities, Police forces and vested financial interests are somehow objective and impartial and have not long-since learned to employ the spinning services of PR consultants and advisors must have disengaged from the last thirty years of social, political and business history in Britain.

Posted on 25 Oct 2011 22:11:51 BDT
Charlieost says:
Hi M. You may be right there but December gets closer and we should find out at some point just how valid the case of the authorities against these men is found. I do accept that my original title for the thread was more an emotive response than logical. Well it's all over at Dale Farm now anyway.

And this thread has pretty well covered all views and has been interesting to take part in.

Cheers. C ost.

In reply to an earlier post on 28 Oct 2011 17:10:24 BDT
Pipkin says:
Hi Charlie,
Dis you catch the programme in the week about Dale Farm and Travellors in general? It showed what Bristol Council had done. Instead of throwing away money, they decided to make twelve hard standing plots, each with a toilet and recycling facility. On a brown field site, in amongst an industrial estate at a cost of 1 million. The Councillor was asked if he thought that was too much to be spending on this problem, and replied that it was costing double that every year, to get court orders, evict and clear up after travellors; and was only equal to providing twelve houses. Now that makes sense to me?
Regards,
Mx

Posted on 28 Oct 2011 21:31:05 BDT
C. A. Small says:
Margaret; Dartford council did this, the pikeys trashed the site, stole the plumbing and left.

Posted on 29 Oct 2011 00:49:40 BDT
Charlieost says:
Hi Margaret. No did not catch the programme because I only get the Irish channels and then only at my partners as I choose not to have a television. Books, the internet and music are enough for me.

Hi Clive. Then surely those who choose to wreck the site can be denied any such places in future. If there was a coherent traveller strategy in your country than perhaps this would be possible.

Posted on 29 Oct 2011 11:16:36 BDT
C. A. Small says:
how do you prove who did what?

Plod would not nick the scum who dumped road tarmac waste on the village green as there was "no proof who did it" despite the truck in front of the pile which had all the equipment in the back, and some left over road waste! They did however leave a P.C on the green handing out leaflets saying " leading a nomadic lifestyle is not illegal"!

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Oct 2011 19:14:10 GMT
Charlieost says:
Hi Clive.That is just so funny (the PC and leaflet bit). No wonder you get riots over there. I'm surprised that there wasn't one on the village green. :)

Posted on 31 Oct 2011 19:19:10 GMT
C. A. Small says:
If ever you wanted to see a thoroughly miserable pc ( who had probably upset his sgt) who was thinking "this was not what I joined up for" this would have to be it!

kent police, when it comes to travellers, are sh*te!

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Nov 2011 15:14:52 GMT
Penguin Egg says:
Jackson is an idiot, isn't he?

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Nov 2011 05:28:23 GMT
Beautifully written. I salute you.

Posted on 13 Jul 2012 17:56:07 BDT
Last edited by the author on 13 Jul 2012 17:58:38 BDT
Charlieost says:
Well it some time for this case to come to court and by now most people should know the outcome. Two parents sent to prison on the testimony of men who have been compromised by police who are determined to gain a conviction and hysterical ranting by the Daily Mail comparing their accomodation to a concentration camp which surely must count as a dire insult to concentration camp survivors everywhere. I have seen the accomodation and I presume that for press reasons the worst example was shown on television (and speaking of which, a TV was in the corner of the caravan). I have seen far worse in council rented flats in the UK and hostels for the homeless can be pretty filthy.

It is clear to me that the powers that be wanted an example to show Irish travellers that the boot could come down at any time and this concocted trial gave them the opportunity. It has precedents in the Battle of the Beanfield and Bloody Sunday in the North.

Oscar Wilde questioned whether it was posible for an Irish man to get justice in Britain. It seems from this trial and so many others that the answer is still no and that goes for Irish women as well and the children that will suffer the loss of their parents.

This whole affair stinks far more than the accomodation looked like it might.

In reply to an earlier post on 13 Jul 2012 23:11:52 BDT
I agree! these vermin are infesting layby's near me and thefts from local farms have rocketed - by 'travellers' after scrap metal. They leave horses tethered on 12 foot ropes, next to main roads, without access to water and in blazing heat. When moved on, they leave a mass of litter and flytipping, including biohazardous material and sharps. They drive around in unroadworthy vehicles, often the vehicles are untaxed, uninsured and, if you are unlucky enough to be hit by one of their vehicles, don't ask for insurance details, as you may (as happened to a friend of mine), be threatened with extreme violence. The travellers treat the local Emergency Dept at York Hospital as their personal walk-in centre, turning up with a lot of the family in tow, often intoxicated, aggressively demanding instant treatment - despite having not paid a penny in tax or National Insurance. As you say, those do-gooders who defend them should go live next to them. They did NOT "rescue" a suicidal man from the bridge. They KIDNAPPED a vulnerable adult and forced him (and others) into a life of slavery, those who escaped were recaptured and severely beaten and threatened with murder. The 'reviewer' "charlieost' is talking absolute rubbish. The O' Connors are violent thugs who deserve to spend a long time behind bars.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2012 15:40:43 BDT
C. A. Small says:
Charlie- with the best will in the world- cobblers.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Jul 2012 16:43:13 BDT
Mr B Tonks says:
Hi Charlie,

The whole episode is a mass of contradictions, more so that the Daily Mail is the main rag promoting this story,
One of the 'slaves' was a former alcoholic who was weaned off alcohol after 3 months and put to work by one of the brothers according to the DM
Contradiction, if the man was an alcoholic and then became sober I'm sure he would have regained his faculties as well, realised he was being severley abused and escaped.
I'm not defending the Irish travellers at all, I worked in the building trade when I first left school and come across some real nasty characters among the building game fraternity - English as well as Irish who would exploit anyone at the slighest opportunity!
However a lot of men I worked with in them days were quite happy to doss down anywhere, unwashed for days on end with no basic facilities.
They were not sub intelligent just rough men who didn't care much for the niceties of life and were even prepared in many cases to work for a pittance as long as a roof of sorts was provided at the end of a day and there was enough money for booze.
Doesn't excuse this family for exploiting the situation but unfortunately there are many people who will accept any sort of treatment and live like pigs because they can't be bothered to better themselves!

Posted on 14 Jul 2012 17:37:55 BDT
Charlieost says:
Thanks for the feedback. Goes to show how divisive this issue is. There was an article in the Guardian recently about justice in America and how the system is scewed to getting a conviction particularly if the case has recieved a lot of publicity and how misscarriages of justice are so common there. With papers such as the Daily Mail and Telegraph plus many of the redtops I can see this being apparent in the UK. They had to get a conviction really didn't they. Just as a certain footballer had to be seen as not making a racist comment.

Three good posts in response. Thanks again.

Posted on 15 Jul 2012 07:34:04 BDT
C. A. Small says:
To defend these travellers because they are Irish is racist , pure and simple. and is a slur on every decent Irishman and women.

In reply to an earlier post on 15 Jul 2012 18:41:48 BDT
Charlieost says:
I can see your point there Clive though can one be racist against ones own race?

I still believe that this case is a misscarriage of justice and will some time in the future be proved to be so. It would not of course be the first and I am sure will prove not to be the last.

In reply to an earlier post on 16 Jul 2012 08:36:20 BDT
Last edited by the author on 16 Jul 2012 09:15:14 BDT
Molly Brown says:
Can you be racist against "your own race"? Rio Ferdinand seems to think you can't be.

In reply to an earlier post on 18 Jul 2012 11:05:11 BDT
I wouldn't term the expression racist, more an accusation of betrayal to his cultural heritage.

However, by apparently supporting the accusations made against Ashley Cole on a public forum, Rio Ferdinand has clearly shown the world that he is some kind of idiot.

Posted on 18 Jul 2012 11:09:45 BDT
Molly Brown says:
This whole fiasco has been totally orchestrated by Rio Ferdinand, he is a trouble maker, and imo a bitter, twisted man. Shame we had to pay for HIS day in court.

In reply to an earlier post on 18 Jul 2012 11:17:43 BDT
I agree that RF has behaved pretty badly but remember what and who started it all off.

In reply to an earlier post on 18 Jul 2012 11:33:10 BDT
Molly Brown says:
The battle to be the England Captain I gather?
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Discussion in:  politics discussion forum
Participants:  38
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Initial post:  12 Sep 2011
Latest post:  9 Aug 2012

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