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Showing 1-25 of 45 posts in this discussion
Initial post: 23 Mar 2012 14:50:39 GMT
[Deleted by the author on 21 Oct 2012 03:38:31 BDT]

Posted on 23 Mar 2012 19:33:28 GMT
gille liath says:
Hmm...all of a sudden, Kindle is brilliant for history. And I bet there are loads of other, hitherto unsuspected subjects for which it is also brilliant?

See you on the biography, philosophy, science, etc forums...

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 19:44:01 GMT
the only problem with kindle is it's inability to enlarge diagrams and pictures (at least the ones in books i have bought) which can be very frustrating. on the other hand being able to change font size is great. must spend more time searching for those bargains.

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 19:48:38 GMT
gille liath says:
I can see their plus points, but I'm one of those old-fashioned people who likes real books (and bookshops) and doesn't want to see them disappear - which is the likely end-point of this process. And I'm cynical enough to wonder whether Kindlette's enthusiasm for the gizmo is entirely that of a disinterested amateur.

Posted on 23 Mar 2012 20:13:09 GMT
Gille,

i got my kindle in Jan and apart from the above mentioned problem i love it. i just don't have the space to store books any more and i love being able to highlight, make notes, word search and ear mark pages as it makes reference so easy. i also have a case for it with a light which means i can read it without disturbing others, on a plane or train at night for example and the text is so easy to read and easy on the eyes. i had to try it to be convinced i'd like it but having tried it i do love it. many times i have known i'd read something in a particular book and had to search for ages to find it or given up but i can now do a word search and i'm in with a chance. once you get good with the highlighting you can bring up all the highlighted passages in a book which when you have a good idea of what you highlight is also very useful.

last but not least you can go on line to the kindle store from wherever you are and buy a book so you never get stuck somewhere with nothing to read or a poor selection of popular books on a shelf that you're not interested in!

am i selling it to you?

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 20:26:14 GMT
Last edited by the author on 23 Mar 2012 20:32:45 GMT
gille liath says:
Ha, no, not really. I suppose like CDs, DVDs etc, I'll have to cave in eventually and get one - but it'll be a sad day. The organic quality of a book, especially an old one - its smell, feel, the wrinkled pages where you dropped it in the bath, the bug you squashed on page 52, the postcard from Marbella you left in it as a bookmark, the dedication written by the original buyer to someone long-dead; it can become a part of your life in its own right. There's no way technology can replace that.

But maybe even worse is the fact you can't really browse for books on the internet. You can only look for the sort of thing you already know - you can't just see something you'd never have thought of, as you can in a bookshop (especially a 2nd hand one), pick it up, and discover something fantastic which you never knew existed.

I'm not convinced Kindles are all that, either. As Kindlette inadvertently suggests, they increase the disposability of books. You download stuff, don't bother to read it; delete it at the click of a button, and then download another bunch of equally pointless stuff. Feedback on the Kindle forum indicates they only last 2 or 3 years - planned obsolescence of the most cynical kind. And I already know I don't like reading from computer screens - I don't think that's only because of the back-lighting, though it's hard to put my finger on exactly what it is.

And since this is turning into the sort of post I can't read, I'll stop there.

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 20:45:53 GMT
i used to love wandering round second-hand bookshops but no longer have the time to do it. i find Amazon gives me a very good selection of books and also i can read what others have thought of them which i sometimes find useful. i was sort of dragged kicking and screaming from the bookshop to Amazon just as i've been manhandled to Ebay but given the lack of time i seem to have these days it's working out really well. i do think that it's better to buy an electronic book and not read it than a paper one. also better to delete an electronic one than throw away a paper one. the kindle only lasting a couple of years is disturbing but then with the pace of technology the 'kindle' in a couple of years will no doubt be faster, in colour and with a host of new features. Amazon apparently keep a record of every kindle book i buy so i can always download again never loosing a book which when some of them cost a lot of money is pretty handy.

i find that i can browse on Amazon by looking at what others are looking at and that can take me off on a new direction if i have the time.

there are still books not available for the kindle and one of them i really want to read so that's annoying as i don't want to buy a paper book now i've invested in a kindle!

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 21:31:19 GMT
[Deleted by the author on 21 Oct 2012 03:38:48 BDT]

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 21:37:22 GMT
Last edited by the author on 23 Mar 2012 21:57:00 GMT
gille liath says:
"I probably know more about history than you ever will."

I wonder what makes you think that? But no, I was referring to the Kindle. Your recent threads look to my cynical eyes like marketing for it. Apologies if that is a mistaken impression: we've had so much spam over the last few months, masquerading as genuine posts, that you get fed up of it.

"please do not come hear [here] again"

I'm afraid that's not an appropriate demand on a public discusssion forum. If you actually have something of substance you want to discuss, as opposed to plug, I'd be interested to hear it.

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Mar 2012 22:07:53 GMT
[Deleted by the author on 21 Oct 2012 03:38:57 BDT]

Posted on 23 Mar 2012 22:41:59 GMT
Oracle says:
Gille - I think the kindlette (like many others) is just excited because she's got a new Kindle and there are loads of cheap and free books to read on it. I don't think that Amazon need random threads on obscure corners of the forums to promote the Kindle.

Kindlette - Gille has as much right to post here as anyone else, regardless of whether he has a historic doctorate or a Kindle (?!). He's apologised for thinking you were spamming. Why not just let it go?

In reply to an earlier post on 24 Mar 2012 08:00:08 GMT
Damaskcat says:
You can browse for books on the internet - what about the free samples you can download? 10% of an e-book so that you can make up your mind whether you like it or not? E-books are also enabling publishers and authors to make their out of print books available again. I am finding Kindle marvellous for obtaining digital copies of out of print paper books which I could never have afforded in paper format because second hand copies are hugely expensive.

I read both e-books and paper books and I can't see paper books disappearing any time soon. As for books shops - it's like anything else if they don't provide what customers want then they won't survive - and nor should they.

Posted on 24 Mar 2012 13:26:39 GMT
Sou'Wester says:
Re Kindle, it seems to be a good machine for many people to access fiction but I'm not aware of much specialised non-fiction work being available electronically; not sure that I'd particularly want it in electronic form either. I'll often have several large hardback books spread across the table, opened at diagrams, maps or reference pages to help with various research projects. That said, I do use the Internet as well to help in this work (but, as with other sources, you have to be careful and do as much cross-referencing and independent verification as you can) and email has been an absolute godsend for swapping notes with other people etc.
So I'm not a complete technophobe but think we just need to be careful in getting too enthusiastic about every new invention that comes along. Electronic books are probably with us to stay; whether or not Kindle represents the way e-publishing will go in the long time alone will show.

In reply to an earlier post on 24 Mar 2012 14:36:50 GMT
Damaskcat says:
Sou-Wester - there are nearly 700,000 non-fiction books listed in the Kindle store - compared with 443,000 fiction.

I have read many non-fiction books on my Kindle. Kindles are not very good for diagrams or charts or maps - I don't think anyone would dispute that. But as there are apps for PCs there is nothing to stop people viewing such things on a PC.

I certainly would never say that Kindles are only any good for fiction.

Posted on 24 Mar 2012 15:59:24 GMT
.W says:
My tuppence worth... I have a collection of nearly a thousand "real" books, about 60% non-fiction. Bookshops and the library are places which were a second home to me. The feel of books, the smell, uncovering a treasure in a second hand bookshop, finding a copperplate inscription, oh I could enthuse all day. But all this was when I was mobile. Now, as a wheelchair user, dependent on very expensive taxis to go on my once-every-month library visits, (which has only in the last month become wheelchair friendly), I cannot tell you how much the kindle has come to mean to me. I can no longer hold, or easily turn the pages, of most of my "real" books. I can no longer get into most of my local book shops. I bought my kindle at Christmas, and I can now again read my old favourites, my old friends. It was like being given the key to the Alexandrian library. There is a huge amount of non-fiction to choose from, including history. (Yes, "real" history.) Many disabled people do not have the freedom/choice to visit a bookshop, a library, a records office. Can't we all just agree that there is a place for both paper and ebooks?

Posted on 24 Mar 2012 17:26:31 GMT
Kelp Bed says:
All I can say, is that since buying my kindle, I have read more books, fiction, non-fiction as well as histor,y than I have in my whole life!
It has opened up a whole new world to me!

In reply to an earlier post on 24 Mar 2012 17:52:03 GMT
Sou'Wester says:
Damaskcat: I stand corrected and actually find your remark quite encouraging. Nonetheless, whilst in no way wishing to condemn Kindle, I think we should be just a wee bit cautious before placing all our eggs in one basket; I have an extensive non-fiction library and am wary of switching all that to a medium whose longevity has yet to be proved. Probably wouldn't be able to do so anyway as the sort of minority interest, specialised subject books I use do not - as yet - generally appear in electronic form.

Posted on 24 Mar 2012 17:59:19 GMT
J.Yasimoto says:
"I have an extensive non-fiction library and am wary of switching all that to a medium whose longevity has yet to be proved."

Indeed. DVD recordings last about 30 years. Electronic devices... also about 30 years. How many electronic devices from the '70s are you still using?

By comparison, (good quality) paper can last thousands of years!

In reply to an earlier post on 25 Mar 2012 10:11:27 BDT
Damaskcat says:
I'm not suggesting in any way that no more paper books should be produced - far from it. There are still plenty of books that I would never consider buying in digital format because of the limitations of e-readers. I don't think of books and e-books as an either/or situation more as an and/and situation. I read and buy both formats and will continue to do so.

In reply to an earlier post on 29 Mar 2012 21:05:34 BDT
.W says:
Paper??? Good grief, why use paper over vellum??? Paper will never catch on.

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Mar 2012 11:48:43 BDT
Vellum! i'm still struggling with this Papyrus stuff and am campaigning to bring back the clay tablets.

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Mar 2012 16:20:30 BDT
Last edited by the author on 30 Mar 2012 16:20:50 BDT
Yangonite says:
Talking of clay tablets............. anyone catch that thing about the Hittites last night (Thurs)?

Interesting lot methinks.

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Mar 2012 18:08:22 BDT
Yangonite,

very interesting lot although i missed whatever that thing was last night. didn't they have running battles with the Trojans or were they thought to have been the Trojans? i seem to remember that they gave Egypt a run for their money as well with incursions into their turf.

what was last night's info about?

In reply to an earlier post on 30 Mar 2012 20:12:17 BDT
Last edited by the author on 30 Mar 2012 20:35:34 BDT
Yangonite says:
It was about how the Hittite scripts came to be deciphered; how this then showed them to be of Indo-european stock unlike the Assyrians, Babylonians and Egyptians; the mystery of why they built their capital in barren mountainous Anatolia - completely off the beaten-track of the ancient world; how they disappeared from the pages of history very suddenly, probably as a result of civil war rather than external conquest.

A few questions it didn't answer were: where they actually came from before Anatolia; where they went after seemingly evacuating their own capital; and what their relationship to the Trojans was.

(EDITED)

In reply to an earlier post on 2 Apr 2012 10:44:32 BDT
gille liath says:
Programmes like that are so frustrating, always 99% padding and BS. I saw a couple of minutes of it last night, and right away they had some line like: 'the Hitttites were on a mission to become the greatest empire the world had ever known. And now only one power stood in their way: Egypt!'

Click!

(and that, btw, is why I don't rate BBC4.)
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Discussion in:  history discussion forum
Participants:  12
Total posts:  45
Initial post:  23 Mar 2012
Latest post:  3 Jul 2012

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