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In reply to an earlier post on 16 Dec 2011 20:25:27 GMT
gille liath says:
That was a joke!!! I was gently trying to make the point about spamming - obviously I needed to ram it home a little harder.

But as you say, it should be win-win.

Posted on 16 Dec 2011 20:37:32 GMT
Last edited by the author on 18 Dec 2011 10:55:43 GMT
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Posted on 16 Dec 2011 20:41:24 GMT
Anita says:
As a reader I'm perfectly happy about this "authors'" forum.

A question though. Do you really think fiction/kindle (etc) forums are exclusive for indie authors? I mean, if I ask for recommendations on some particular subject, I'm not exactly happy to get 100 suggestions of "please try mine" variety. And then, why these forums should be exclusively friendly to indie writers? I kind of think they are for everybody. I might get interested in some sp books, but I don't feel obliged to read any of them. Do you?

Meet the authors forum is a perfect place to promote your books IMHO. It's for you, use it. I'm sure I shall be visiting some threads there from time to time WITHOUT getting irritated. Am I the only one? LOL

And one more little tiny thing. What about asking you to be a little, erm, remorseless to your book BEFORE publishing it? And please don't tell me "do you know how difficult is to write a book?" Or: "Can you write a better one?" Even if I couldn't write at all, still, it's not my duty to like all books. Sad as it is, there's this ugly term of graphomania. Quote from Wikipedia: According to Kundera, graphomania is the groundless claim, sometimes being large-scale, of being a writer. I'm definitely NOT saying, that you or another guy has this problem. But believe me, it happens.

Just an opinion with no offence intended to anybody.

Still, the forum is very welcome

Posted on 16 Dec 2011 21:19:27 GMT
[Deleted by the author on 16 Dec 2011 21:20:05 GMT]

In reply to an earlier post on 16 Dec 2011 21:59:37 GMT
MoonMan says:
I'm largely in agreement with Ryan that this is "a long overdue cure for a problem of epidemic proportions, and backed by a vocal and sizable majority." I differ from him only in my belief that a majority of the majority is in fact silent.

The fact that those defending the ancien regime are mostly indies tells its own tale. But there shouldn't, in theory, be a problem: the new forum established by Amazon welcomes readers as well as writers, so those readers who appreciate promotional posts will presumably go there, leaving writers no worse off. But everybody knows that it will in fact be an indie ghetto, hence the squeals of indie pain.

Let me declare my own interest. I too am of the indies. But self-promotion makes me cringe, and my own faltering efforts have been laughable: I sell no books. Still, I greatly respect those talented writers whose promotional skills have contributed hugely to their success. But the Amazon fiction forum, set up as a place for readers to discuss novels and short stories, is being used by indie authors as a platform from which they can shout their wares at people who probably don't want to hear them.

It just ain't right.

In reply to an earlier post on 16 Dec 2011 22:03:16 GMT
carocaro says:
Ryan promoting your work isn't spamming. Sending it to all and sundry, repeatedly & without regard is and yes it's not good and needs curtailing. Censorship in this case is someone not having the freedom to say in a linked thread that here is my work and it fits in with this thread and discussion...because that's promoting and self publicizing and no longer allowed except on one specified site with out any relevant links. It is also censoring what I and others want to know and hear about as of possible interest and of books that I may wish to buy when I look at or join in a discussion thread that interests me too. This censorship coming about from some people who have constantly complained to Amazon and acted as if they speak on behalf of all readers which they most certainly don't. This I feel is fair reply and comment to your statement.

Posted on 16 Dec 2011 22:06:13 GMT
carocaro says:
Under the new rules though gille, I go to a comedy forum and chat with readers and author's but the author can't tell us about their book as it fouls the new rules. To do this it means going off to yet another forum and trawling through reams trying to find anything that fits in either your preferred genres or author etc!

Posted on 16 Dec 2011 22:10:39 GMT
Garscadden says:
carocaro - it really sounds like you will enjoy the MOA forum, so wouldn't it be better to just head over to there, and be happy, rather than trying to convince people who are happy to see the back of misplaced adverts that it is a terrible thing to not have those ads anymore?

As a customer I am more happy to not wonder if someone is contributing to a discussion just as a chance to bring it round to a point where they can try and push their substandard self published book on me.

In reply to an earlier post on 16 Dec 2011 22:11:20 GMT
Ethereal says:
Or you could have your chats in the authors' forum which I'm guessing is what the authors who are there would like!
They have themselves regulated threads according to genre too.
Better than crying over spilt milk...
I also doubt reader complaints had anything to do with it, it was bound to happen here after the US and Az have their own agenda.

Posted on 16 Dec 2011 23:59:42 GMT
Last edited by the author on 17 Dec 2011 00:04:31 GMT
J A R P says:
I've been using these forums to promote my work for ages. When I come here I am doing my work by talking with other people. I am promoting my work by talking with you lot. For me, there is often no difference between the work I do as a writer, and the work I do by talking with you pseudonyms. People probably don't know that I write on the basis of what people say to me here. From time to time I show off and hint at what a star I am because of my books - but really they embarrass me. What is important, if anything about these forums is that people are honest and speak their minds.

When people do, you can learn things from each other.

I myself like to see people tell me their ideas. I also like to learn from people when they are forced by anger to reveal themselves.

I've stayed away from this fiction forum, and have never been here before for long. I found people talking about their own work repellent, absolutely disgusting. It may not be that bad, but it is to me. You can't learn or talk in an atmosphere where people are all luvvies, and trying to avoid being honest about what they really think of each other.

I can imagine a way in which an author of fiction could do a lot of good in this place, and learn things about what is good in a book by probing other people about what things they like, what is the heart of a book, what is good style, and how to create a work of art. But coming here after typing out the book itself, and just plugging it - what good is that ever going to do?

The only person who really counts in that respect is some kind of agent with connections. That sort of person might like to hear of your new book. But I don't think agents are in a majority here. So advertising your work is just rude and unprofessional.

-

I paint pictures. I have a natural talent. If I don't paint, I might be letting myself down. I enjoy it, too. I just do it. I become engrossed. I learn skills about oil and colour. I study the old masters. I buy books about the masters. If people don't like my work, that is their business. It is good work and its time will come. I know that I need to find an agent for it, really. Roaming around the National Gallery with photos of my work, showing it to random art lovers and tourists is not going to help me or them. Isn't coming here to advertise your wares the same sort of thing?

Posted on 17 Dec 2011 00:17:51 GMT
Last edited by the author on 17 Dec 2011 00:19:58 GMT
J A R P says:
Looking at this fiction forum, the threads all seem to be by self-publishing authors. Realistically, you would expect it to be a mix of people who like a chat and are bored; and, also, a sort of university seminar on literature in which, say, the person who likes Shakespeare tends to win all the discussions.

It is not like that. I have been on sites where people plug their work by submitting it to others to read. When you read somebody's work, you get a credit and somebody else is forced to read and review yours. If you think that your message is clear, or great, or as good as Dickens, you are usually in for a shock. You also find out what many self-publishing authors are really capable of. Half is very bad. A quarter is good but trivial. The final quarter is publishable trash about crime, or witches, or history.

I myself found out that I was not so good as I thought. I believe that some people just have it: the love of language, something they were born with, as it were. And also a sort of second sight for finding meaning in existence.

I suppose that you have to enjoy good books before you can write them. The writers whom we study at university, the ones who have remained with us, were all well read in the classics.

These pages should have been filled with discussions about the classics, discussions held between 'aspiring authors'. Instead, ..

Having said that, this forum might be as dead as the philosophy forum in a few weeks.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 11:57:58 GMT
It is spamming, and your continual complaints suggest you put your ego before all other considerations. Too bad. You're just going to have to abide by the rules like everyone else.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 12:53:33 GMT
Hey, Gille

I saw that ;-)

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:07:34 GMT
gille liath says:
I did think you got it at the time - but if so, I don't understand why you've brought it up. Maybe so we can share the laugh all over again?

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:09:03 GMT
Last edited by the author on 17 Dec 2011 13:10:27 GMT
gille liath says:
It's all good publicity, eh?

That was so barefaced and irrelevant that I can't help admiring your chutzpah. Sort of. ;)

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:11:45 GMT
Ethereal says:
I don't always agree with everything you say but do enjoy your ironic touches!

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:15:32 GMT
J.Yasimoto says:
I wouln't mind an ironic touch every now and then.

Oh, you mean touché.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:17:41 GMT
Ethereal says:
Now, J.Y, there's no need to get jealous!

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:25:05 GMT
Last edited by the author on 17 Dec 2011 13:48:58 GMT
gille liath says:
Aw, you don't?

I wasn't being ironic this time, as it happens: I'm genuinely baffled.

...Well, maybe just a little bit.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:25:37 GMT
gille liath says:
Ironic touches are okay but ideally I prefer proper ones.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:27:47 GMT
Last edited by the author on 17 Dec 2011 13:28:23 GMT
It was meant a joke, my dear. All the discussions about if we need no or yes votes... There are more imporant issues in this world. Oh well. I thought I'd lighten up the discussion a bit saying how much I needed a new flat, or, at least, quiet neighbours. Or the money to make some other good things happen. It was not a plug, well, maybe, to show off my beautiful boy.

Not been on the forum for a long while, but I have a tendency to derail threads. I promise to try and be better.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:44:21 GMT
gille liath says:
'or a vivarium' ...and I, poor sap, fell right into the trap.

I have no problem with derailing - the more various a discussion, the better. I'm even happy to talk about lizards - or at least hear about them, since I personally know diddly. It's just, as everyone is no doubt sick of being told by now, that I don't like selling thinly disguised as discussion.

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:44:48 GMT
J.Yasimoto says:
I'll take what I can get!

In reply to an earlier post on 17 Dec 2011 13:47:49 GMT
gille liath says:
Indeed...

Posted on 17 Dec 2011 13:55:50 GMT
monica says:
Er, is there an Official Amazon Community Team calendar that's dated differently from the ones Valued Customers use?
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Discussion in:  fiction discussion forum
Participants:  66
Total posts:  416
Initial post:  15 Dec 2011
Latest post:  20 May 2014

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