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Boulez on Shostakovich


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Posted on 2 Feb 2014 17:21:44 GMT
JayJayDee says:
I said 'mostly'.
;-)
And nine years is a long time in football!
Nine years between each Mozart symphony would have delivered him four at best!

Posted on 2 Feb 2014 17:17:05 GMT
Last edited by the author on 2 Feb 2014 17:19:13 GMT
Given that Liverpool's most recent addition to their honour roll took place only in 2005, I suggest that's a little previous. I might add that most of the great composers we discuss here predate vinyl by a very long way. Some things are simply timeless.

In reply to an earlier post on 2 Feb 2014 17:08:37 GMT
JayJayDee says:
Harry, that record is worn out, being mostly recorded on vinyl.

In reply to an earlier post on 2 Feb 2014 17:06:33 GMT
JayJayDee says:
I think you're mixing him up with Elton John's Powdered Wig period.

In reply to an earlier post on 2 Feb 2014 16:54:46 GMT
Last edited by the author on 2 Feb 2014 17:03:18 GMT
JayJayDee says:
The Brahms 4th Symphony was very special to my parents and I heard it constantly throughout my childhood - firstly from a set of Weingartner 78s (orange label. I recall) bought by them over a two year period after the war (circa 1950) and later from the Toscanini NBC performance on LP.
Its tunes (themes) are almost constantly with me. It is both tuneful and philosophical (via the development of the material). And its tunes, whenever I hear them, remind me of a wonderful childhood. So the power of Brahms' melody is not to be denied, because I have done an awe-ful lot since.

Or a lot more awful.... whatever!

Posted on 1 Feb 2014 09:42:36 GMT
Last edited by the author on 1 Feb 2014 09:43:23 GMT
Bruce says:
Given that the most famous Austrian contemporary has enjoyed a spell as governor of California, this might be a clue to his favoured hangouts
?

In reply to an earlier post on 1 Feb 2014 01:42:42 GMT
Last edited by the author on 1 Feb 2014 01:56:43 GMT
mancheeros says:
Yes, WAM would very definitely be performing his hits at the Super Bowl, where he'd be doing high-fives with his bestest friend Andre Rieu. WAM would be married to a skinny Italian heiress but would be caught having it off with an overweight plumber in the backstreets of Berlin.

In reply to an earlier post on 1 Feb 2014 01:32:06 GMT
Last edited by the author on 1 Feb 2014 01:32:41 GMT
Henry James says:
Would he (WAM) be performing at the Super Bowl?
(do you kids in the UK know what the Super Bowl is?)

In reply to an earlier post on 1 Feb 2014 01:12:39 GMT
mancheeros says:
If WAM was alive today he'd be the David Beckham of the classical music world - absolutely everywhere! One week you'd see him hanging out with the fashionistas in Milan and New York, the next week he'd be doing his UN ambassador thing in the slums of Mumbai. He'd be scoffing strawberries and sipping Pimm's with royalty at Wimbledon, schmoozing in the directors box at Chelsea. Needless to say, his legion of fans would be treated to breezy little gems like 'The Abramovich Variations' and the 'Stamford Bridge Suite', an opera on the life and death of Michael Jackson, a symphony dedicated to the street kids of Brazil...

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 18:51:32 GMT
Last edited by the author on 31 Jan 2014 18:54:08 GMT
Henry James says:
Mondoro asks: How many have agreed with Tchaikovsky's view that Brahms was the lesser composer to Delibes?

In the year 2014, if you asked the opinion of casual listeners, the answer would of course be very few.

If you ask people who have listened to more than 10,000 hours of classical music, the number would be infintesimal (and would include Bruce).

Not that that "proves" anything aesthetically. For aesthetic proof, you would have to ask an unambiguously authoritative critic like Henry James.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 18:48:39 GMT
Last edited by the author on 31 Jan 2014 18:49:54 GMT
Bruce says:
I also think they would be more "local" for Wolfie! A short drive on the autobahn from Salzburg.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 17:55:19 GMT
Currently they may be, but his popularity over more than two centuries shows he'd take the long view. There are only two teams in Europe with more successful records than Liverpool and Bayern are not on that very short list.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 17:42:48 GMT
Bruce says:
I think that Mozart would undoutedly be supporting Bayern Munich - the most successful team in Europe! :-)

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 17:27:42 GMT
Roasted Swan says:
I thought they supported Calamari .........?

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 16:52:16 GMT
mancheeros says:
Harry, most sardines are Barca fans, apart from those that come from Sardinia and they support Cagliari.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 16:18:36 GMT
Mondoro says:
What emerges from this discussion of what composers think of other composers is the conclusion that it doesn't really matter -unless we a truly saintlike (and some saints have 'dislikes'), we all have dislikes, some of which are explicable, some of which are based on ignorance, or are simply irrational as they run counter to the majority view. How many have agreed with Tchaikovsky's view that Brahms was the lesser composer to Delibes?

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 16:18:09 GMT
Mozart would have abhorred the comparison. He would undoubtedly have been a Liverpool fan.

Can't speak for the sardine.

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 16:07:55 GMT
Roasted Swan says:
was that before or after he said; "When seagulls follow the trawler it is because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea". Is it better to be compared to Mozart or a sardine OR (if you are Mozart or a sardine) be compared to Ryan Giggs.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 15:33:46 GMT
Not to Mozart it wasn't.

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 15:29:38 GMT
mancheeros says:
Eric Cantona said Ryan Giggs was like a Mozart symphony. Was that a compliment?

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 14:54:44 GMT
Bruce says:
But they've got some great tunes...! ;-)

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 14:36:06 GMT
mancheeros says:
Also from that Gavin Bryars 'on Brahms' article...

"I remember that I found it very reassuring when I discovered Percy Grainger's antipathy to the works of the classical "masters" Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven. I had previously thought, along with many other pieces of received cultural wisdom, that the status of such composers could not possibly be questioned."

So that's Percy, Gavin and me that don't like Mozart and Beethoven. The numbers are mounting...

In reply to an earlier post on 31 Jan 2014 10:18:54 GMT
Last edited by the author on 31 Jan 2014 10:19:41 GMT
Bruce says:
Well that's the same for everybody then, isn't it!? ;-)

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 09:56:10 GMT
Last edited by the author on 31 Jan 2014 09:59:21 GMT
So the Internet is reliable when you, Bruce, agree with it, and not when you don't. Thanks for making that clear.

Posted on 31 Jan 2014 09:38:46 GMT
Bruce says:
And we know how reliable that is! ;-)

I read this on the internet :

http://www.gavinbryars.com/work/writing/occasional-writings/brahms
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