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Terminator Reboot...

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Initial post: 12 Nov 2013 19:08:49 GMT
Adam Jackson says:
How can they reboot this from scratch and yet still cast Schwarzenegger as the title character????

Sounds dreadful!!!

Posted on 12 Nov 2013 21:31:45 GMT
Avatouir says:
Ow me back

Posted on 12 Nov 2013 21:42:32 GMT
Adam Jackson says:
Would only work for me if they really did something different with the terminators; maybe several of them, more ordinary in appearance perhaps, more emotionally advanced/conflicted?? perhaps working more covertly as a kind of splinter cell perhaps?? Certainly not interested in a one man army thing again!!!

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 10:24:46 GMT
The only good thing about this is that it's being produced by Megan Ellison (she's produced some very good films). If I'm honest the only way to go with the Terminator franchise is a reboot because Rise of the Machines and Salvation just ground the series into the dirt imo. For his crimes to the franchise Schwarzenegger should be kept far far away. It's this odd thinking that he should be connected in any way that bugs me. Unless it's just a side thing, like you see a model of a T800 in the background, even then it just feels cheesy. The whole series annoys me if I'm honest because only a bunch of idiots could mess it up post Terminator 2. Everything is pretty much shown how the series should look and move forward in the first two films. From the images of giant terminators crushing skulls in an apocalyptic future from Terminator 1, the descriptions of the future given by Reese as he tells Sarah, to the images of an older John Conner directing the battle in T2. It's all there, Cameron basically laid it all out. But somehow McG (what a monumental prat) et al managed to f it up.

Sorry to disagree with you Adam Jackson, but I hate the idea of a more emotionally advanced/conflicted load of Terminators. Maybe they should sit down with their Terminator therapist and work out all their anger issues. It's just opinion, so it's cool. But that idea of an emotionally conflicted cyborg, is it just programming, what is consciousness, what is life... It just feels like it's been done to death.

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 11:05:22 GMT
[Deleted by Amazon on 16 Dec 2013 10:03:06 GMT]

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 11:11:42 GMT
salvation was the right way to go,, they just made an azz of it, Bale was a great Connor, the setting was good, but the whole Terminator Human thing as the star was weird, it should just have been about Connors rise to prominence and leader of the resistance when all hope looks lost he inspires them to a great victory and they fall in behind him, cue the resistance.

A new trilogy with Terminators going back in time and John and Sarah being the same age through weird time stuff, (Thats the plan) sounds awful.

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 11:48:20 GMT
Last edited by the author on 13 Nov 2013 12:08:46 GMT
I would have made T3 in the aftermath of the bombs dropping as the machines begin their systematic termination of all human kind. Starting maybe through a Sarah Conner monologue (Like her monologues at the end of the first two films). Then it's about Sarah Conner, older pulling the few remaining survivors together. The thing is Sarah Conner is the central character in the first film. It's really her story. That sort of gets muddied a little in the second film. But Cameron for all his faults knows how to make strong female roles in his films. Then in the third they do the criminal and just get rid of Sarah Conner. So I would have brought her back center stage for the 3rd film. She's the symbol of humanity. She's the mother. It's the central reason Reese is drawn to her. Oedipal maybe but symbolically it works. The other thing is it should be stripped back. The reason the original Terminator works IMO (even more so than even the second film) is that it has a very simple idea behind all the time travelling stuff. "It's what it does, it's all it does." says Reese. And that's it, Cameron keeps that as the films mechanical heartbeat. So my version would have that feeling of being steadily hunted down by something that doesn't feel pain, doesn't feel remorse. It's a machine and as something made from flesh and blood we should feel that cold unstoppable sense of progression. And since my version wont ever get made I'd have Sarah sacrifice herself at the end so that John can escape. The 4th film is obviously a scarred John taking the fight to the Terminators. That whole anger, losing sight of his humanity in a push to destroy the machines that killed his mother. Directing, driving and pushing the human resistance as if they were robots. There'd be the whole cathartic stuff as the entire quartet of films ends at the point Reese gets sent back in time.
That's what I would have done.

In reply to an earlier post on 13 Nov 2013 12:45:58 GMT
[Deleted by Amazon on 16 Dec 2013 10:03:07 GMT]

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 13:28:46 GMT
I have to say I like the idea of Robocop vs Terminators. But I've always been a fan of mash-ups. They almost never turn out how I wish though, not on film anyway.

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 14:22:15 GMT
I'm pretty sure there is a Robocop vs Terminator comic, along with Terminator vs Aliens and Terminator vs Batman (and just about every other vs combination of Terminator, Aliens, Robocop, Predator, Batman and Judge Dredd). And TBH it can't be any worse than AvP or T3.

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 14:45:41 GMT
"I'm pretty sure there is a Robocop vs Terminator comic"

Yeah, I remember that. Think I still have some issues at my parents house. Loved the comics when I was a teenager but I haven't read them recently so can't remember if they were actually any good or if I just remember enjoying them.

The AVP film has jaded me to the point where I think crossovers should be outlawed and Paul W.S. Anderson should be locked up and hit in the face with a wet trout every day until he can produce something as good as Event Horizon.

Posted on 13 Nov 2013 16:46:02 GMT
I must be one of the few people who actually liked T3. It was the weakest of the original 3 but decent enough. I quite liked how the events of T2 simply delayed judgement day and I thought the ending was quite good. It made sense to go into the future for salvation and I also liked the fact that a) john wasn't the big inspirational leader and b) that skynet tried something different with an emotional terminator after failing 3 times before with cold killing machines.

The future shown in T1 and T2 could never happen as in my opinion the events of the terminator films changed the time line which was mentioned by john in the voice over at the start of salvation.

I like to think that john originally had a different father and in the original timeline simply grew into the resistance leader. The events of each film altered the timeline so by the time we get to salvation its not the future we expected, it's been changed. I know the first film slightly contradicted this but it was meant to be a stand alone film and I think the sequels did a really good job despite the small contradictions set up in the first film.

A reboot to me is ok to me. I quite enjoyed the sarah connor chronicles which I think of a slight reboot.

Posted on 14 Nov 2013 01:59:12 GMT
Last edited by the author on 14 Nov 2013 01:59:51 GMT
Fair enough Wayne but one question, how can the original film create a contradiction, surely the later films create the contradiction? It's like setting up a group of laws in episode 1 and by episode 4 you're contradicting and changing the laws to fit with your own premise. The thing about T3 for me is that little bits I quite like. I like the acting, on the whole, I even like how it ends. But all the bits that link it up I hate. I know hate seems a bit dramatic but The Terminator for me is how some people see Die Hard or Robocop. The moment Arnie does that glasses bit I wanted to punch him in the face. I can explain the whole upgraded terminator, I get how it's possible, but I hate lazy thinking and while the T1000 was possibly fine for T2, it still bugs me btw (Cameron had the idea of a liquid Terminator in his original script for the first film but the FX wasn't good enough). However just doing the same for T3 is lazy writing imo. Also while I like interesting mind melting time-travelling or multi-verse etc stories, I don't see that as The Terminator central theme at all. You can say that the future seen in T1 can't happen because of what happens in the film, but without getting into a debate about adjusted timelines, I actually don't care. The reason being that's the vision set out, and that's the vision I'm interested in. Otherwise just make a sci-fi with killing robots in it and call it Robot Killing Machines or something. For me once Sarah Conner was removed and the core ideas of T1 were seemingly just a pastiche then I lost all respect for the franchise.
I agree that they made the right decision to not make John the big inspirational leader in the first film set in the future. T4 is essentially the (or start of) second act. But the problem for me is that the moment you have a robot that doesn't know it's a robot, that has emotions, or at least is programmed to think it has, I find it just way too cliched. John taking its heart at the end is just, well, horribly lead footed. About Skynet trying a different tactic, well if Skynet wanted to really wipe us out it would be really really easy. There's no need for this complicated cyborgs, time travel, let alone ones with implanted memories so it has emotions and thinks it's human... It just needs a virus. Job done.

In reply to an earlier post on 14 Nov 2013 08:02:36 GMT
[Deleted by Amazon on 16 Dec 2013 10:03:17 GMT]

Posted on 14 Nov 2013 09:34:35 GMT
Last edited by the author on 14 Nov 2013 09:37:17 GMT
Crixus says:
Theres a short film on youtube of Batman vs Alien vs Predator, it's actually pretty well done.

"I must be one of the few people who actually liked T3"

I stopped reading after this.

EDIT- I carried on reading and actually like your views

Posted on 14 Nov 2013 18:11:20 GMT
The contradictions that T1 made were trying to make out the timeline was a continual loop. What I mean is john gives kyle a picture of sarah in the future which means he knows kyle is his father and has to send him back. If kyle and the t800 never go back then skynet won't exist as its because of the remains of the defeatef t800 left in the cyberdine factory at the end of T1 that provides the knowledge to create skynet.

T1 was basically a loop that meant the events had to have already played out for the future that kyle dreams about to even exist. This is why it worked as a stand alone film as we think that skynet sent the t800 back in a last ditch attempt to alter the future when in fact it had to send it back to even come into existance.

Posted on 27 Nov 2013 14:02:49 GMT
My starter for ten,Sam Worthington's character,Marcus Wright.I was under the assumption he was more cyborg than full on robot,more Robocop than Terminator so don't see any confusion or problem with his human feelings being portrayed as they are.The film may have had it's faults but overall an enjoyable and logical extension to the franchise,the only thing required of a further chapter is a) T1 and Kyle's transportation into the past then in sequence for continuity purposes b)John Connor's final confrontation with Skynet,his betrayal and death by the T1(from Judgment Day) after which T2 and 1 are sent back then the revelation of Skynet's back up plan to send T3 into the past,Skynet's final demise,the third T1 is sent back to avert the T3's plans and John Connor is revived as a cyborg construct.I think that just about covers all the main points but I expect there will be some strong objections and differences of opinions from others.Go for it,that is after all the point of these threads.Reviewing the above comments,can anyone explain how Skynet chooses which point in time to return his Terminators to? From his future perspective it is history,altering with each successive failure to remove John Connor,both past and future become fluid,changing what was,what is and what will be in a constant flux of non-linear moments,piling paradox upon paradox until the resultant chaos explodes in a sub-atomic meltdown of catastrophic universal proportions .

Posted on 28 Nov 2013 19:16:49 GMT
Last edited by the author on 28 Nov 2013 19:20:22 GMT
A lot to get my head around there obrien. Good points . The funny thing is you wrote this: "Skynet chooses which point in time to return his Terminators to?" Why have I always presumed Skynet was female? lol I'm not certain that's something I should think about too much.

I think about the Marcus Wright bit is you're right he's a cyborg but I think so is T101 (Arnie's Terminator). They're both constructed from organic and artificial. The difference I think is that Marcus was programmed (or had a part of his cerebral cortex left intact. That's where memories are kept right?) so that he believed he was still human.

In reply to an earlier post on 28 Nov 2013 22:22:42 GMT
Last edited by the author on 28 Nov 2013 22:27:09 GMT
Bang on Mr T,funny thing I always assigned the male gender to what is more properly "it",never thought of it before.Also for literary purposes,he still had a heart,wherin lies the true seat of being human on an emotional level,the brain thinks but only the heart can feel.
Actually the last part as more whimsy than serious debate :-),referring to previous post to avoid any confusion.

Posted on 11 Dec 2013 22:10:19 GMT
Adam Jackson says:
Even worse, The Rock is in the frame, pointless!!

Posted on 23 Dec 2013 13:36:39 GMT
Argentophile says:
Terminator 3 & 4...Terminator without James Cameron just does not work; it ends up as by-the-numbers Hollywood sci-fi that has no heart or vision.
I'm always amazed that Cameron is constantly knocked for not being able to create a story, etc. etc. I seriously doubt that his extraordinary success would have solely occurred on spectacle and special effects alone. He may never be an award winning screenplay writer but he can definitely construct decent stories and characters (especially strong female leads) that draw you into the movie and are not overwhelmed by the scale of the film. John Carter, as just one recent example, illustrates exactly what can happen to a mega-budget movie when you can't write an involving script.

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Dec 2013 14:01:15 GMT
Actually the Heart does nothing but pump blood around, its has no feelings and can do nothing else but pump blood, all emotions, feelings are all chemical impulses in the brain. Therefore Him havinga heart was merely a small weakness, there was no need, unless that blood was required to pump real blood to said Cortex to amintain it?

Posted on 23 Dec 2013 15:09:57 GMT
T1 - Good low budget 80's sci fi flick, but better than the usual fair at that time.

T2 - took it to the next level, so Cameron could really show what he intended in the first place

T3 - Strange set up, introducing a freedom fighters gang for them to take out, actor fine who played John, but he was miscast as John for me. The Female terminator that controls machines etc, that was just rotten, I could have came up with better in a drunken stupor on the floor

TS - I think it had the right idea for how to reboot the series with modern day CGI special effects, the problem for me was no definitive Bad guy, Mindless machines dont maketh a good bad guy, a menacing Terminator does, so if they were going to give a Terminator more brain power, it should ahve been an Evil thing IMO

so for mr TS was better than T3 but still extremely flawed.

In reply to an earlier post on 23 Dec 2013 15:42:22 GMT
I really enjoyed TS tbf, i thought T3 was by far the weakest but even that was kind of ok.

I thought both T3 and TS were better than anything Cameron has done since T2.

Posted on 23 Dec 2013 15:46:57 GMT
I'm not sure if it's allready been mentioned on here but i read somewhere that cameron allegedly dream'nt the whole story of the terminator. Thats some f***** awsome dream to have.
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Discussion in:  action discussion forum
Participants:  13
Total posts:  34
Initial post:  12 Nov 2013
Latest post:  3 Jan 2014

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